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Status of Bench Testing of GS inverts.


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52 minutes ago, The Blind Wolf said:

I wonder if they make 500 watt model?

My tank's element is nominal 1.8kW at 240VAC so I feed it with a 120VAC inverter which works out at about 450W.  Applying Ohm's law etc let's you work all this out.  Your 4500W 240V element would have a resistance of about 12.8 ohms.  Put 120V across that and you get about 1.1kW.

Make sure you can still put enough power (kWh) into the tank to heat the required amount of water to the required temperature.

 

ohms-law-formula-wheel.png

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Sid, is there a way to have the screen rotated counter counter clockwise 45 degrees?  I'm going to have the AC terminal to the left and the battery terminal to the right, this will allow for a better connection on batteries, instead of up and over, I can connect dirctly from the side 

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3 minutes ago, The Blind Wolf said:

Sid, is there a way to have the screen rotated counter counter clockwise 45 degrees?  I'm going to have the AC terminal to the left and the battery terminal to the right, this will allow for a better connection on batteries, instead of up and over, I can connect dirctly from the side 

Huh?  LCD rotated by 45 degrees? 

I must not be getting what you mean...the LCD is flush with the top of the inverter.  Actually in the same location as a Power Jack LCD.

I actually have my bench setup the same was as you are mentioning...battery terminals on the right, AC terminals on the left.  This is "upside down" for the LCD, but I've put a screen-flip function in the settings, which not only flips the LCD graphics upside-down, it also reverses the button functions to match.

Shouldn't be any problem.

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2 minutes ago, Sid Genetry Solar said:

Huh?  LCD rotated by 45 degrees? 

I must not be getting what you mean...the LCD is flush with the top of the inverter.  Actually in the same location as a Power Jack LCD.

I actually have my bench setup the same was as you are mentioning...battery terminals on the right, AC terminals on the left.  This is "upside down" for the LCD, but I've put a screen-flip function in the settings, which not only flips the LCD graphics upside-down, it also reverses the button functions to match.

Shouldn't be any problem.

well flipping is only going to keep the words sideways not up and down ways..  the gs will be hung horizontial .

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3 minutes ago, The Blind Wolf said:

well flipping is only going to keep the words sideways not up and down ways..  the gs will be hung horizontial .

You mean rotate the LCD 90 degrees.  Battery lines on the bottom, AC on the top (or maybe vice-versa)

Unfortunately....no, we don't have the ability to rotate the LCD like that.  Not without a machine shop to cut the lid differently.

12kw inverter is designed that way (though both battery and AC connections are on the bottom), LCD designed for wall-mounting.  But it's not ready for sale yet...

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3 minutes ago, Sid Genetry Solar said:

You mean rotate the LCD 90 degrees.  Battery lines on the bottom, AC on the top (or maybe vice-versa)

Unfortunately....no, we don't have the ability to rotate the LCD like that.  Not without a machine shop to cut the lid differently.

12kw inverter is designed that way (though both battery and AC connections are on the bottom), LCD designed for wall-mounting.  But it's not ready for sale yet...

ah, so you saying that the lcd shows sideways?  I figured it showed like on the pj the bottem would be the ac and the top was the power, but, from what I'm now understanding it didn't show that way?  so you had to read the screen with the inverter going side to side from ac on left and power on right?  Okay, well never mind that will work then.  I thought the pj had to be hung to be able to read the screen correctly 😛 no wonder everybody said it was hard to read. . .

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1 minute ago, The Blind Wolf said:

ah, so you saying that the lcd shows sideways?  I figured it showed like on the pj the bottem would be the ac and the top was the power, but, from what I'm now understanding it didn't show that way?  so you had to read the screen with the inverter going side to side from ac on left and power on right?  Okay, well never mind that will work then.  I thought the pj had to be hung to be able to read the screen correctly 😛 no wonder everybody said it was hard to read. . .

Not sure what you can make out on a little 3.5" 128x64 pixel LCD, but if the PJ screen is hard to read...most of the text on the GS inverter is 1/2 the size.  PJ got 4 lines of text out of the screen; the GS inverter gets 8 lines.

Need to get that WiFi server / setup function added.  But there's so much on  my plate to do--and you need your inverters.

I think we just need to go with split-phase sync on 2 single-phase inverters--I can guarantee that will work well, and you'll be able to get the full 12kw load.  I don't want you to be having problems with your system.

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1 minute ago, Sid Genetry Solar said:

Not sure what you can make out on a little 3.5" 128x64 pixel LCD, but if the PJ screen is hard to read...most of the text on the GS inverter is 1/2 the size.  PJ got 4 lines of text out of the screen; the GS inverter gets 8 lines.

Need to get that WiFi server / setup function added.  But there's so much on  my plate to do--and you need your inverters.

I think we just need to go with split-phase sync on 2 single-phase inverters--I can guarantee that will work well, and you'll be able to get the full 12kw load.  I don't want you to be having problems with your system.

What, still no go on the last update?

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Well, darn.  I guess we go that route, though if I get it and need more power, well. . . just have sean run two l1 and l2 I'll do as I saied about, two black and two red 10 wire cuase I'm not going to fork out another $100 bucks on breakers and wire. its already wired and ready to go. all I got to do is mount the inverters run the batts to them, and fire it up, just well was only going to fire up one gs inverter to begin with, but with it being split guess I'll have to fire both up, then flip the breakers on so it don't do a one  leg dance.

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On 5/12/2021 at 3:18 PM, InPhase said:

You can run it on 120 volts and it will use 1/4 the power as it will at 240 volts. But ultimately you won't save anything because it takes the same amount of energy to heat a gallon of water to a given temperature at 500 watts or 10 million watts. What changes is the time that it takes.

At 120v it's half the power. I changed out the upper element in my tank to 120v 2000 watt & a 240v 3500 watter in the bottom which at 120v will use 1750 watts but you are correct, lowering the element wattage just delays the time it takes to heat the water. A 500 watt element doesn't exist 'cuz it would take forever to heat up a tank. A 1500watt 120v is the smallest I've ever seen.

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3 minutes ago, Bossrox said:

At 120v it's half the power. I changed out the upper element in my tank to 120v 2000 watt & a 240v 3500 watter in the bottom which at 120v will use 1750 watts but you are correct, lowering the element wattage just delays the time it takes to heat the water. A 500 watt element doesn't exist 'cuz it would take forever to heat up a tank. A 1500watt 120v is the smallest I've ever seen.

Half the volts means half the amps, which makes it 1/4 power. Use Ohm's Law.

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Just a reminder Sid about the custom mods on the inverter you're sending. I expect you're real busy getting all the orders out & could misplace the the order specs of it being wired for 120 only & the remote switch jack & @48v input. Thx!

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Just now, Bossrox said:

Just a reminder Sid about the custom mods on the inverter you're sending. I expect you're real busy getting all the orders out & could misplace the the order specs of it being wired for 120 only & the remote switch jack & @48v input. Thx!

Actually it's just Sean on all the orders; I'm handling design, programming, sourcing, etc.  More than enough to keep me busy.  I know Sean is busy trying to get the single-inverter orders out; I will buzz him to make sure.

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Hmmm. wow, this is one of those weeks that well nothin big happen. just posting of PJ cheap stuff on you tube and well the unplug of the wifi board.  Other then that. its all hush, hush.  . .  Maybe sid is makeing a new product for a big reviel?

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On 5/12/2021 at 2:03 PM, Sid Genetry Solar said:

I think we just need to go with split-phase sync on 2 single-phase inverters--I can guarantee that will work well, and you'll be able to get the full 12kw load.  I don't want you to be having problems with your system.

Just ordered another 6k because we're going to retire that big, ol pig central AC on the roof. (It's amazing how much your load can be reduced by getting rid of old ****. Dryer, refig, washer...now ac...this new stuff doesn't really have a very long payback period...)

Now some questions: does this mean you're giving up, or just delaying daisy chain? What's the procedure for converting the split phase to single phase on the inverter (assuming it's a configuration setting and assuming it's already a feature)?

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27 minutes ago, Richard said:

Just ordered another 6k because we're going to retire that big, ol pig central AC on the roof. (It's amazing how much your load can be reduced by getting rid of old ****. Dryer, refig, washer...now ac...this new stuff doesn't really have a very long payback period...)

Now some questions: does this mean you're giving up, or just delaying daisy chain? What's the procedure for converting the split phase to single phase on the inverter (assuming it's a configuration setting and assuming it's already a feature)?

It works.

 

on my ssytem you take two breakers l1 black wire and l2 red wire. and your ground and N wire to the N.  You take your two black wire and put on the master system, and a ground and N wire to the N unless you get a 104 then it be yellow and white to n on the output . with a seperate wire on one of the L out  then on the slave you have both red wire and yellow white or bare and white to N same as master with the extra wire from the master going to L1 input of slave.  that leaves your l1 and N on your master for charging feature.

 

Also please note that you need to let sean or Sid  know that you are doing this. other wise it won't work on just a normal setup.  you can do it with one wire, but I think it would be simple to leave it at two wire to breaker to reduce the work around to doing one wire.

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11 minutes ago, The Blind Wolf said:

It works.

 

on my ssytem you take two breakers l1 black wire and l2 red wire. and your ground and N wire to the N.  You take your two black wire and put on the master system, and a ground and N wire to the N unless you get a 104 then it be yellow and white to n on the output . with a seperate wire on one of the L out  then on the slave you have both red wire and yellow white or bare and white to N same as master with the extra wire from the master going to L1 input of slave.  that leaves your l1 and N on your master for charging feature.

 

Also please note that you need to let sean or Sid  know that you are doing this. other wise it won't work on just a normal setup.  you can do it with one wire, but I think it would be simple to leave it at two wire to breaker to reduce the work around to doing one wire.

Also Dasy do work, Sid is just haveing to tweek it more.  its in my case that I'm running ashort run to my breaker less then 10 foot and it causeing a issue cause the inverter don't see the change fast enough to keep up and causes it to shut down.  If your running a longer run which Sid can tell you how many foot needed then it works fine.

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2 hours ago, Richard said:

Now some questions: does this mean you're giving up, or just delaying daisy chain? What's the procedure for converting the split phase to single phase on the inverter (assuming it's a configuration setting and assuming it's already a feature)?

Parallel mode is tricky at best; definitely not throwing in the towel with the feature, it just needs fully tested to our satisfaction before shipping it.

I can test things on my bench and have them work well--but need someone else (i.e. Sean) to test it and verify that it works for him as well.  The last parallel tests (which passed my tests) didn't work at all on his bench--which is why I've revised it.  Now it's just a matter of his finding time to test the revised code, and see if it works better.

I'm recommending split-phase sync to @The Blind Wolfsimply because he's been waiting sooooo long, and it's a solution that'd get him 12kw total output, with solid surge capability, right now.

 

Converting split phase to single phase on the inverter...it's going to void your warranty, for sure (as it's a rather risky job if you don't know exactly what's going on):

  • Void the software warranty, then CFG -> System -> System Setup -> set output to 120v (instead of 240SP) [note: it may use 110 and 220 instead of 120 and 240; same difference]
  • this should bump the output voltage to ~100-140vAC (it'll need recalibrated to 120v out)--NOT safe to run big loads on it in this state!
  • Break the warranty sticker, and open the case (powered off and disconnected)
  • Rewire the transformer output wires to the control board: wires 1,3 go to T-L1, and wires 2,4 go to T-L2.  (T-N is not used now.  Split phase has wire 1 -> T-L1; wires 2,3 -> T-N; wire 4 -> T-L2).  NOTE: If you get a "GTM Regulate Fail" error after powering the inverter on, the wires on T-L1 and T-L2 will need swapped.
    • basically this is putting the 2 output transformer taps in parallel for double the current.  Split-phase mode has the 2 output taps in series for 240v center-tapped.
  • Rewire the AC output wires so there's 2 wires each going to O-L1 and O-L2 (none to O-N); the doubled up wires are necessary as for a 6kw inverter that's now 50A at full load (6000 / 120 = 50).  Keep in mind that the hall sensor needs to be wired up the same, with the L1 and L2 wires running through it in opposite directions (for proper load registering on the LCD screen)
  • if you're wanting to use AC input...
    • make sure the solder jumper (clearly marked) is jumped to 240v, not 120v -> system setup input voltage will need set for 120vAC input, not 240v.
    • AC input "hot" goes to I-L1
    • AC input "neutral" shares the output neutral lines (going to O-L2)

Basically in a nutshell, that's how it goes; note that it does void the warranty, as changing system setup/configuration can be quite risky.  Sean will be able to make the changes if necessary.

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8 minutes ago, Sean Genetry Solar said:

Matt. A picture for you. Hoping to ship these today. Just need to get sid to upgrade to windows 10 and we will be all set

20210517_092618.jpg

Are you going to show off them on a video? and remeber I can't see the pic 😛

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