Rev. C board install help

[Going Off Grid]

hey its GOG from youtube, I'm in the middle of changing my main board from b to c and am looking for a picture of a rev C all assembled. dont want to blow it up, hard getting parts over boarder lol

[Sid Genetry Solar]

Whew, FINALLY got at least something across the border...what was the magic sauce that actually worked for once???  We'd like to send you a set of the new GS LegacyFET boards, if we can be sure that we aren't just pitching yet more money down the drain known as customs confiscation...

I'm more than happy to provide assistance via video call to make sure everything's wired up correctly before turning it on and/or running diagnostic tests to verify everything's golden before turning it loose.

 

Here's a photo of a Rev. C board in a GS inverter, mostly wired up:

sharp eyes will notice the absence of FET boards 😉.  Things to note when referencing the above photo:

• The red alligator clip from the "PWR+" screw terminal to the positive heatsink is a wire connection you would need to fabricate--as it's not present in the Rev A.1/B units.  The Rev. C board will not power on without this wire, so it's kinda important 😉.  (Power is no longer pulled from the mainboard rainbow ribbon cable.)
• "NEG" terminal is changed from that dastardly spade terminal to a ring terminal; notice I set the spade terminal against the ring terminal, but it needs to be a proper connection here.
• Yes, there are 3 wires on the "Neutral" screw terminal...2 transformer wires, and the one Output Neutral wire.
• Yes, I didn't put all 4 mounting screws on the control board 😉
• Note the direction of the wires going through the current sense transformers.  L1 / L2 must be crossed through the sensors for total output reading; polarity is important--though if it's wrong, the inverter will fault out with an error.  (It won't damage or hurt anything.)

 

Going from a Rev. B to a Rev. C board is relatively easy, with mainly just the control board power wires changing.

[Going Off Grid]

thank you so much! I will try and get it done and if I get stuck will ask again lol

[Going Off Grid]

does the screen still need the positive and negative now that the main board is getting the new pos and neg?

[Sid Genetry Solar]

9 minutes ago, Going Off Grid said:

does the screen still need the positive and negative now that the main board is getting the new pos and neg?

Absolutely.  The only connection between the control board and WiFi board is the little tiny 3-pin "CPU cable", which is completely inadequate for powering several amps of fans!

EDIT: yes, at least one new wire is required for the control board power.

[Going Off Grid]

is this the right spot to plug this in? it goes to screen.

[Going Off Grid]

ok this is it done, how's it looking?

[Sid Genetry Solar]

11 hours ago, Going Off Grid said:

is this the right spot to plug this in? it goes to screen.

No.  You can throw that connector in the trash; it is not used in Rev. C.  (On A.1 / B, it was a bit of a copy of the PJ method with a power sense chip on the WiFi board.  On Rev. C, I redesigned it to eliminate that; power monitoring is now completely done by the control board MCU.)

 

10 hours ago, Going Off Grid said:

ok this is it done, how's it looking?

Pretty good.  As mentioned above, pop out that 4-pin red-red-black-black connector and pitch it.  And move the fans back to the WiFi board like before; I unfortunately have not yet written the code for PWM fan control from the control board!

 

There's also some startup test diagnostics to run to make sure the current sensors (and transformer wiring) are installed with the correct polarity; I will plan to provide that quick info a bit later today.  The inverter will throw errors if any of them are backwards, so it's not like you won't know 😉.

in short:

• "Xformer Polarity" -> transformer polarity is backwards: swap the L1 / L2 transformer wires (NOT the red AC output wires)
• "GTM Regulate Fail" after putting a load on the inverter -> AC Output current sensor is backwards: reverse the direction of the red AC output wires through the sensor
• ...not sure if there's an input polarity error (there should be), but testing for that one is slightly harder.  Will provide details a bit later today.

[Sid Genetry Solar]

The "official" way to check the AC input current sensors is from the Diagnostic Info page.  (OUT screen -> press Enter to select the page -> press Down 4x, battery voltage will change to "Diags" -> press Enter.)

About halfway down this (scrolling) screen, you should find the following view:

The numbers of interest are circled in the far right column (in this case, both are 0). 

Under normal load, the AC Out number should go POSITIVE.  If it goes negative, the inverter will assume that a grid-tie inverter is backfeeding power through the output, and it will frequency shift to try to "shut down the GT"--but obviously, as a load isn't a grid-tie inverter, the "backfeed" will never disappear.  Which will result in the GS inverter reaching 62Hz with power still "backfeeding"--and as a last resort, it'll shut down with a "GTM Regulate Fail" error.

If you're testing for the AC Input current sensor, you'll obviously need the inverter in Pass-Thru mode (with AC input power connected).  When you put a load on the inverter, both circled numbers should go positive.  (If either number goes negative, that sensor polarity is backwards: swap the direction of the AC power wires through it.)

Note that in AC Input mode with 120v input and 240v output, the AC Input "current" number will read approximately double the corresponding AC Output "current".  This is normal, and is why the 120v input mode maintains the same 25A maximum current as 240v input mode.

 

Again, I'm happy to help via video call if necessary.

[Going Off Grid]

great thanks a ton!

[Going Off Grid]

My rev c board seems to be a 24v one is it possible to make it a 48v or do I need a new one ? that is the highest I can push the input voltage.

[Sid Genetry Solar]

Sent you a PM, trying to figure out what's going on.....

 

2 hours ago, Going Off Grid said:

My rev c board seems to be a 24v one is it possible to make it a 48v or do I need a new one ?

It appears to be configured for 24v--but as is the Genetry "universal parts" goal, it can be easily reconfigured for 48v (or any other option including 12v and 36v).  You will have to void the software warranty to change "system setup" settings--as it's entirely possible to cause inverter damage/failure due to the "system setup" settings being incorrectly set (not to mention messing up the internal rewiring necessary for properly implementing a system setup change).

to void the warranty, you'll probably have to try several times to "pass the gauntlet."  I purposely made the unlock sequence difficult, so nobody could truthfully say, "I don't know how that happened."  (CFG -> System -> Unlock Configuration)

Once it's unlocked, restart the inverter, and then go back to CFG -> System.  You should see a new item underneath "Unlock Configuration", namely, "System Setup."  Entering that screen, you'll see the model number setup--this is where the System Setup settings including the maximum load on the inverter, the battery voltage, the output config, etc.  Assuming your GS6 transformer is wired for 48v, set the battery voltage setting to 48v, exit the screen, and restart the inverter (power button).  Note that reconfiguring a GS control board for 48v when the transformer is wired for 24v...will technically allow the inverter to run, but it'll blow FETs pretty quickly under any significant load.

[Going Off Grid]

that great! thanks a ton, its a 48v transformer, but I run at 60v lol, was on a 12s 44v bank when i blew it lol

[Sid Genetry Solar]

16 minutes ago, Going Off Grid said:

that great! thanks a ton, its a 48v transformer, but I run at 60v lol, was on a 12s 44v bank when i blew it lol

yeah, but that event appears to have been a result of a shorted isolation transformer 😉.

12S Li-Ion would be 42v.  48v would be 14S Li-Ion.

[Going Off Grid]

12s ion is 44.4v nominal 50.4v full charge, you thing the lower voltage had a toll on the inverter ? I will have to tell you how it died soon it was probably my fault.

[Sid Genetry Solar]

15 minutes ago, Going Off Grid said:

12s ion is 44.4v nominal 50.4v full charge, you thing the lower voltage had a toll on the inverter ? I will have to tell you how it died soon it was probably my fault.

Nope, it'd just have a flat-topped sine wave under loads/low battery.  No issues or concerns there.

The issue with a low-voltage transformer config with a high voltage battery setup...is that the transformer current ratio does not change.  Efficiency starts to fall pretty rapidly, mostly due to the ferrites saturating--which starts slamming the FETs with brief deadshorts per cycle, etc., etc.

[Going Off Grid]

at 60v you mean, it ran so good on 60v thats what I plan to use my 12k on as well is 60v :S

Edited December 19, 2022 by Going Off Grid

[Going Off Grid]

also my fet temps where super low.

[Going Off Grid]

also run my magnasine 4448 inverters at 60v 😄

[Sid Genetry Solar]

18 minutes ago, Going Off Grid said:

also my fet temps where super low.

That's a side effect of driving the FETs firmly and cleanly.  We haven't had any overheated FET failures on GS inverters--no, they generally either work perfectly or explode!  It's actually pretty amazing how cool the FETs run in the GS12...they barely need any fan cooling at full load.

 

21 minutes ago, Going Off Grid said:

at 60v you mean, it ran so good on 60v thats what I plan to use my 12k on as well is 60v :S

With sufficient ferrite capacity (which there should be), that shouldn't be an issue.  What I'm referring to is running a 24v transformer spec at 48v...which would be the equivalent of running a 48v inverter at 96v.  Same ratio--but very different results!

[Going Off Grid]

O OK I understand now thanks!